(Disscussion - I hope -) RE: Access
May. 21st, 2007 08:10 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png)
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Ok, I was writing an entry explaining my position on this and asking for opinions when I decided my position would stunt any actual discussion, and that working from the primary materials in a public post to
last_pleasure would probably elicit more interesting responses, so:
These are direct quotes from public posts in fanfiction communities I follow, over the last 48 hours or so.
i.
* bolding removed.
ii.
* hyperlink removed.
i. concerns a personal fiction community where posting access is held by one individual, ii. is controlled by two mods who will (correct me if i'm wrong) award posting access so long as you swear by your age, and who, in their userinfo/mission statement, cite discomfort at "unrestricted reading list[s]."
And now consider this a general call for your thoughts/feelings/personal opinions.
Edit interestingly, the age-declaration entry re: ii. is a public post with unscreened comments, asking the individual to state "Yes, I'm old enough to vote!"
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These are direct quotes from public posts in fanfiction communities I follow, over the last 48 hours or so.
i.
IMPORTANT: You have to join the comm in order to view anything rated NC-17.*
* bolding removed.
ii.
This story is posted as a locked entry to the [name excluded] comm. You need to be eighteen to join, so after clicking to join, stop by this* post and leave an age statement.
* hyperlink removed.
i. concerns a personal fiction community where posting access is held by one individual, ii. is controlled by two mods who will (correct me if i'm wrong) award posting access so long as you swear by your age, and who, in their userinfo/mission statement, cite discomfort at "unrestricted reading list[s]."
And now consider this a general call for your thoughts/feelings/personal opinions.
Edit interestingly, the age-declaration entry re: ii. is a public post with unscreened comments, asking the individual to state "Yes, I'm old enough to vote!"
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 08:46 am (UTC)Uhm, well, anyway. In terms of fiction I really think it's a matter of 'warning' more than anything. Bookshops do not stop you from buying truly unsuitable fiction. I could send my nine-year-old brother to buy me Irvine Welsh's Trainspotting and know he'd come home with it despite the cashier probably knowing it was vastly unsuitable. Should this even be allowed?
I don't know, I really I see no reason to stop people from reading whatever the hell they want. I think this has more to do with me and my reading habits than anything. I mean, admittedly, I bought Coin Locker Babies by Ryu Murakami without knowing what the first line was. That could have been bad. It wasn't. But it could have been.
I understand that on the internet it's good to cover your backs a little because anyone could stumble across something like an idiot and read it. It's like when you stick Harry Potter into a search engine you do end up finding a whole lot of NC-17 fiction and that's not so good for prepubescent Potter fans looking for games or whatever else.
I don't know though, I'm 17. I ain't old enough to vote. I am amused by the idea that I could just say "Yes, I'm old enough to vote!" and be in anyway though. And, hey, I could vote if I lived in the Seychelles.
(OK. I have exams tomorrow. I have to work.)
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:03 am (UTC)Coin Locker Babies is such love...it brings to mind, Murakami Ryu's Almost Transparent Blue which is pretty damn eroguro, and not in an apologetic or romanticized way... I know the NZ legal authorities regarding rating and censorship very well, and I've always found it interesting that books can get away with blue murder in print, yet online people feel this pressing need to rate and warn about every little thing. I guess I do understand it on one level....yet....
Lol, that's what worries me. If they're really worried about keeping kids out that's not that way to go about it. It comes across as pretty insincere. Of course, I have my own prejudices - I hate these sorts of restrictions, for multiple reasons but especially on principle alone I'd never, ever join a community or state my age on a public post (it's on my profile anyway, but I disagree on principle) just to read fanworks by one person or even a group of people. Mainly because the average quality of fanfiction is very low (especially in the fandom concerned).
(Oh dear. Good luck, my darling!♥ *sends luck across the ocean to blanket-but-not-suffocate you, all aura-like*! [I need to stop these random TVXQ outbursts to you, but I just thoroughly disturbed Simon with princess!Minnie pics *happy grin*] GANBATTE<3)
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:17 am (UTC)Coin Locker Babies is. And I don't know where my copy of Almost Transparent Blue is, I think I leant it to Shanah and she still has it. (You know, when I was reading that in year 11, someone started reading that book over my shoulder and it ended up passed around my whole English class.) And, yep, books can get away with just about anything, it's fairly ridiculous. But the internet is a very dangerous place.
Yeah, it's pretty concerning. But, yeah, it is a bit of a covering-your-back measure that's not really going to do much. And, on principle, I don't like it either. It's pretty pretencious, really.
(♥ *hugs the aura of luck* [You cruel creature! :D I want someone to do that too~] I WILL!!!<3)
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:35 am (UTC)Oh I remember you telling me that! XD Almost Transparent Blue is pretty explicit in some pretty fucked-up ways...If it were a film, surely it'd be restricted (and I'm not sure I'd want to see it, actually...definitely not my favourite of his..).
Is the internet a very dangerous place? For whom, though?
Pretentious, precisely. I don't agree with it on principle, and I don't really understand their reasons, but I assume that they've tied themselves in with their writing pretty transparently or are planning to in future or something, for them to feel the need to do so. Of course, perhaps it's the protection thing *shrugs*. In which case...well...it doesn't work, does it?
(♥♥ [XD You should, it's so much fun.] *waves pom poms and sings ponpon to cheer you on*])
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:12 am (UTC)Cover your own ass on the Internet may be a smart thing to do, and there should always be warnings on fanfiction sites, and general adult fiction sites, what kind of content will be there. And talking about your age, if you're a minor, in fanfic communities for example may not be so wise either as some writers feel uncomfortable knowing that people under 18 read their NC-17 rated works. One might want to take into account that it's verrrry easy to lie about your age on the Internet though :x I mean, I've been having an account on AFF for like a year and I don't turn 18 until in November (plz don't tell on meh :x) so yeah.. that's my two cents anyway.
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:25 am (UTC)Just out of curiosity - NZ has a different rating system than the US and I've read a little on that ratings system but never really felt the need to figure it out (seeing as the way people rate online doesn't really seem to have any consistency and in my own writing I generally use warnings instead of ratings) - does a NC-17 rating restrict audiences under 18?
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:26 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 09:59 am (UTC)Sweden (where I live) have a different rating system as well. We have 'Suitable for anyone', 'From 7 years old', 'From 11 years old' and 'From 15 years old'. I think we used to have a 'From 18 years old' rating as well, but I've never seen it in use in cinemas and the like. I think that the NC-17 rating in the US restricts audiences under 18, but I'm not completely sure as I don't live there.
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 10:07 am (UTC)Ah~ ours is pretty similar to that (well it's G, PG, M (recommended for 15 years and older but not restricted), R-13, R-15, and R-18 although R-13 and -15 are pretty rare) looking it up NC-17 seems to be "No one 17 and under admitted."...(what terrible wording...)but that's not from an authoritative source and I can't be arsed figuring out what the American ratings authority is ^^;;;; Thanks for your thoughts!
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 10:39 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 10:42 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 12:13 pm (UTC)I tend to have a knee-jerk restricting access=bad! reaction anyway, but as far as I'm concerned, people can continue to label their own stories and read by choice. *shrug*
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 07:19 pm (UTC)Labeling..? Isn't that a moot point?
no subject
Date: 2007-05-24 01:09 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-05-24 09:15 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 07:22 pm (UTC)Same here. I've never seen much evidence of consistency in rating fanfics (it'd be impossible to get unless there was one group going around rating everything and I don't see that happening anytime soon), and I don't fully understand the American rating system anyway, although I think ratings are often linked to content...and there are a lot of people who don't post sufficient warnings in their fic headers...
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 02:00 pm (UTC)hot smexadult subjects. If you're 14 and feel it's fine, then hey, who's there to stop you?Also, if the story says NC-17, it's better to leave it to be read at home rather than at school/work for... obvious reasons. *reads yaoi on public library computers, feeling paranoid*
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 07:23 pm (UTC)XD worksafe, yeah.
no subject
Date: 2007-05-24 03:54 am (UTC)<.< I think the same goes for NC-17 RPs... Try to write a reply to a smex rp thread and not glance over your shoulder all the time (even though your sensible self tells nobody is interested in what you do... that is, until you start looking suspicious in the aforementioned way).
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 02:11 pm (UTC)You can't prove a person is the age they say they are + most mods don't check the profile of people who want to join anyway.
There's an arse load of kink out there so not much need to feel all self-righteous about your own smut!fic.
If you do feel uncomfortable posting smut publicly (which is understandable enough) it's just pretentious and priggish to link it on a large comm. You're writing is not that amazing and special, sweety.
I spent quite a while mulling on this one when i still had a fic-journal on Lj. The only reason i could come up with (the only reason that held up to the most minor scrutiny) was ADD MEH PLZ KTHX. Really, if you're going to be like that then leave off acting like it's for srs reasons and you can't stand the thought of little 'uns reading the pr0nz.
sorry, i get bitchy about that one.
also i think this is the first time i've commented you xD hi~
no subject
Date: 2007-05-21 07:32 pm (UTC)Still...I think the "leave me x comments or I won't update this" or "comment or die" or "you read you comment" conditions to reading are more offensive...
XD that wasn't very bitchy. Honestly I want to get bitchy about it too...I posted this because I was almost at the point of asking them directly to explain themselves.
And hey~ back!
no subject
Date: 2007-05-22 01:36 am (UTC)Still, there's a lot of places that burn/ban books even now... maybe the people who restrict like that are from that sort of environment and are afraid?
no subject
Date: 2007-05-22 08:35 am (UTC)Yeah America bans books like mad although I'm not too sure on book-burning in the Western world >.> I don't think it's common, at all. Actually, most countries ban books, but it takes pretty damn nasty content. And I mean nasty. I really doubt they are from that sort of environment, personally. If they were I think they'd be more for making it a real statement of principle (if it was me I'd make a real statement of principle towards freedom of speech & accessibility -.-;;), but if they're so uber worried with being connected to their work they sure as hell wouldn't post public entries around the place. Shrugs.